Energy Matters Forums

One suggestion I will make is to buy one only 1st and try it to see if you like the light. They can be quite different between brands.

somebody wrote:We have recently moved into a new house which has a large amount of halogen downlights. There would be in the range of 50 for the whole house.

Try VECO lighting in Moorabin, they have much better pricing then that, that is OTT for LED now.

Like OP has said buy one and try it first, also have dimmable for a very good price.

I tested a few of the LEDlux lights from Beacon Lighting. Not that exact model however. Their specifications were mostly accurate. Which makes the 8W unit fairly efficient (67 lm/watt). Even if their specs were out by 20% it is still OK. By contrast the older generation Philips 10W Master LED wasn't so good at 34 lm/w.

The Ecolume 6W from Jaycar would be another (cheaper) option.
http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.as ... ID=1007#12

If there are any areas where you need really bright light consider the Brightgreen DR700. It is the only MR16 replacement that I have seen that actually matches a 50W MR16 Halogen for light output (around 700 lumens).
http://brightgreen.com/products/dr700-retrofit/

But all these LED light are very fickle with dimmers. There are too many combinations of transformers, dimmers and wiring to have any confidence any LED light will work. So buy maybe 4 units and test them first on all your circuits. (I suggest 4 rather than 1, as some dimmers may work better under slightly higher load).

I also have a few of the DR450 on order. They claim to thermally throttle when too hot (like in the outback summer) to avoid burning themselves out.
I'll post some testing results when they arrive.

somebody wrote:Hmmmmm. Any idea which transformer the issue is with? Below is an email I just received from the company I purchased the lights from.

I have a dozen DR450's sitting on my desk now. Initially testing without a dimmer shows they work fine with the Osram Redback electronic transformer and a older ATCO wire wound transformer.

Adding a dimmer however and there is trouble. I tried 4 permutations.
1) ATCO TM50-2 + Clipsal universal dimmer.
2) ATCO TM50-2 + HP leading edge dimmer.
3) Osram Redback + Clipsal universal dimmer
4) Osram Redback + HP leading edge dimmer.

1) and 2) flickered badly. Which was surprising as the wire wound transformers should be more compatible. Would be totally unacceptable in normal use in my opinion.
3) Didn't dim very far, certainly not anywhere near 100% to 0%. This would be maybe be acceptable for some people.
4) Flickered slightly when nearly dimmed to 0%. Would really annoy me, but some people might be able to deal with it.

Also when powered on with the dimmer already in the dimmed position there was a 1 or 2 second period of bad flickering in cases 3) and 4) then it stabilises. Which is a bit of a shame as one of the feature of LEDs was immediate 100% output.

This was all done with a single globe in the circuit. There might be significantly different behaviour with multiple globes in the circuit to provide additional load.

In short, they don't dim as well as halogen lights.

Two other minor comments. The lens cover is clear plastic. Not glass. I find it hard to imagine the clear plastic will still be clear in 30 years time. Secondly the shape is different from a normal MR16 halogen. So I had a problem getting it to fit in one bracket. There are three small cut outs in the plastic lens that need to be carefully aligned, if your bracket has nubs on it.

I'll be doing some more testing over the next week and post some additional results.

Did some more measurements on the Brightgreen DR450 LED light. As expected it is one of the more efficient MR16 lights available at the moment. Dimming is still a disappointment, but I am going to try out a few other scenarios over the week-end (with more lights in the circuit).

Hi,

Try DHgate.com. this is like a Ebay side for Chinese wholesalers. I bough some LED 9w MR16 lamps for about $5 each these give out the same amount of lighting as the 50w halogen. Note must be careful as they also sell in bulk, so check the quantity and unit price.

Just to add, I re-did the above dimming tests with 2 lights in the circuit, to provide a bit more load on the dimmer. But the result was more or less the same. Permutation 3) would probably be acceptable, the rest had some problems.

I had someone else suggest that you need to get to at least 3 globes to get better results, but I haven't had a chance to test this.

In terms of transformer compatibility (without a dimmer) the Osram Redback, Nelson Cougar and 3 different wire transformers were all OK. I had some mild to serious flicker with Powerun 410-60, Telbix Ultra60 & Lucci TB60L transformers. So make sure you do some testing yourself before you purchase a large qty.

Edit: When on the right transformer they work well and the light is good.

somebody wrote:Hey LEDMAD, How are you finding the DR450s? Did you get the 60 degree beam?

I got the 40 degree unit, and the advertised angle was accurate.

I have had them installed for a few weeks now without any problem (once I got past the initial transformer compatibility issue).

They aren't as bright as a 50W MR16 Halgoen. Or even a 35W IRC Halgoen for that matter. So in hindsight I maybe should have used a mix of the DR700 and the DR450. Putting the DR700 in a couple of locations were a bit more brightness would have helped.

However once you get into the price range of the DR700, then it really makes more sense to use a kit with a dedicated LED driver instead. (except in one case I seem to have a wire transformer in an inaccessible roof location, so I'm stuck with MR16 lights unless I want to tear out the ceiling to find the transformer).

LED's aren't the only way to significantly improve energy efficiency with recessed lighting. Here's a video which goes over these technicalities. Its not as easy as picking and choosing the brightest LED.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEmNevdHfso