LED lights, marketing vs. reality

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Re: LED lights, marketing vs. reality

Postby Think Wise » Wed Mar 30, 2011 5:14 pm

As good as the energy savings are there is no way you can get 90% light from a 5w bulb. In the end though if you are happy then thats all that matters?

Was the $90 per fitting or whole room?
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Re: LED lights, marketing vs. reality

Postby karlajensen » Wed Mar 30, 2011 5:21 pm

That was the whole room
and these suckers ARE brighter than the 9W cree's I already have in the kitchen and I "guessed" them at about 60% of the halogens.
Admittedly I did the whole lot in one hit hence comparison tougher than say 50-50 of each.

In any case there was WWAAAAYYYY too much light on full bore than way required by anyone.
Now there is still heaps but its not as offensive as it was before where in a living room you could easily see a flea on the black couch
8E + 8W + 8Nth Garage CMS2000-1 with ~4500W in 3 strings of 8.
Fronius Galvo 3.0 inverter with ~6.6kW panels
12x ZNShine + 12x 180W Solarfuns both NW + ZNShine 12x190 facing SE.
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Re: LED lights, marketing vs. reality

Postby Think Wise » Wed Mar 30, 2011 5:34 pm

Well that's pretty great value for a room then!
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Re: LED lights, marketing vs. reality

Postby karlajensen » Wed Mar 30, 2011 5:42 pm

And I just realised I could have had dimmable jobs from the same mob for $10 more for 6.
spewing! :evil:

Incidentally last lot I got were about $200 for 6 and I hunted for those for months. 380lm

Quoting this articlehttp://sound.westhost.com/lamps/dimmers.html
theoretically LED's are upto 100 lumens / watt.
Mine arent that high but closer to 450Lumens (according to their add).

Now the die-hards will say well a 50W halogen makes 900lm.

I have a simple head torch that demonstrates this perfectly -it is switchable from 4 LED's running to 8 LED's running and the difference in light in a dark space is perhaps 10% more even though the source is 100% brighter.

This is how i estimated my 90% light number.
8E + 8W + 8Nth Garage CMS2000-1 with ~4500W in 3 strings of 8.
Fronius Galvo 3.0 inverter with ~6.6kW panels
12x ZNShine + 12x 180W Solarfuns both NW + ZNShine 12x190 facing SE.
Edwards Solar Hot water


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Re: LED lights, marketing vs. reality

Postby gareth » Fri Mar 08, 2013 7:47 pm

In follow up to the first post mentioning they had several large sheds and commercial properties.

For commercial (non-household) applications there are many options to upgrade the standard 36W 1200mm T8 fluoros that we see everywhere.

LED tubes are one option, and not necessarily the best. You will get good energy savings but expect to see some reduction in light output. Unless your light levels are already too close to the Australian Standard this should be ok.

I have recently put together a fact sheet summarising the available options with a discussion on costs and savings. Have a look at http://www.energysmartstrata.com.au/factsheet/factsheet4.html

The big advantage of LED tubes is that they are ideal for use with occupancy sensors where frequent switching would significantly reduce the lamp life of standard fluorescents.

The fact that they can be retrofitted into existing fittings is good news too if you have fittings in good condition and want to get some use out of them. If your fittings are old its probably better to replace the entire fittings with a new T5 luminaire.

One problem with LED tubes is that they (like T8 to T5 converters( are not suitable for use in emergency fittings. In many applications (e.g. car parks) often half the fittings are emergency.
Also the wide range of quality and costs of LED tubes is also an issue. We did a quick survey of online suppliers and found LED tubes at a range of 15W to 24W at at cost of $25 to $90 (the Osram 24W tube and Phillips Master LED tube being the most expensive, so you have to pay big for a trusted brand).
Lastly if a LED tube blows and someone mistakenly puts a fluorescent tube into the fitting it isn't going to work. And don't even think about putting a LED tube into a standard fitting which hasn't had the starter removed... so ongoing maintenance of LED tubes in fluorescent fittings is something to keep in mind at commercial sites.

T8 to T5 converters are definitely a cheaper option, though again not necessarily the best.
Voltage reduction (fixed dimming) is very cost effective for large banks of fittings that use the older magnetic ballasts... but most sites these days have fittings with electronic ballasts.
For firestairs you cant beat the enLighten Chamaeleon dimmable LED with in-built motion sensor.

To summarise what i'm trying to say... many energy saving options to upgrade fluorescent tubes have their advantages and disadvantages, many will effect a reduction in light levels. LED tubes are arguably not as great as they are marketed to be... but then again what is!
Retrofitting LED tubes can achieve cost-effective energy savings in the right application.

Gareth
http://www.energysmartstrata.com.au
http://www.huxham.com.au
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Re: LED lights, marketing vs. reality

Postby offgridQLD » Wed Mar 13, 2013 10:51 am

Just a heads up that next week - Wednesday (in QLD). Not sue about the other states. Aldi will be selling a range of LED drop in replacement bulbs. In bayonet and screw, Mr16, Gu10 and some smaller mini sizes like your rang hood or fridge might use.

The warm white screw and bayonet (typical looking bulb replacement size ) Are all $11 for 4,6,8,10 w. I would go for the 8W & 10w . 600 lumens for the 8w & 800 lumens for the 10w. Although 4w or 6w would be ok if you have a passage way like mine with 5 lights down it :roll: .Listed 35,000 hrs life. I wouldn't bother with the gu10 or mr16 they just don't have the same lm - Watt output. 6w - 8w -10w in the larger size is the sweet spot .

About 1/2 the price of the Phillips or osram in the same wattage and style.I was using the philips 9.5w with around 660lm. I will do a comparison review if i can get my hands on some next Wednesday.

Considering a good brand name CFL of around 12w - 15w is about $6 - $8 Led is a better choice at $11 even just for the health benefits if broken inside your home (especially kitchen or bedroom) along with full brightness when 1st turned on.

Image

theoretically LED's are upto 100 lumens / watt.
Now the die-hards will say well a 50W halogen makes 900lm.


I would say thats about corect although 900lm for a 50w Halogen is max for a new globe most of mine in my on grid house after a few months (even though they are the best philips ones I can find) would be less than 900lm as you can always see the difference when you drop a new globe next to a old one. As the reflectors dull out (from the heat) and become more transparent than reflective over time and a lot of the light is lost through the back of the globe.

So the Aldi units above at 800lm for 10w is 80lm Watt and that's a realistic output for a led that isn't over driven.

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Re: LED lights, marketing vs. reality

Postby franks » Thu Mar 14, 2013 11:21 am

Using SMD LED bulbs at lighting in my shed..8 watt LED bulbs, using 9 to light up a 8x12mts area.
3.04kW Grid Tie system 16 of 190W PVs, Samil 3.3kW
3.8kW PV Stand Alone Off Grid.. 5-8kWHr Per day
24 of 190W PVs
Midnite Classic 150 & Lite MPPT
8 of 6V 600 AH flooded cells (24 volt 1200 AH)
Outback VFX3024E Inverter Charger
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Re: LED lights, marketing vs. reality

Postby offgridQLD » Thu Mar 14, 2013 3:24 pm

I am surprised just nine x 8w led bulbs is enough to light up a 8m x 10m shed.

I used ten x 28w t5 tubes for a 10 x 12m shed and you need lamps over machines and detailed work for it to be enough light.

A pic of the lights in action would be great.

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Re: LED lights, marketing vs. reality

Postby franks » Thu Mar 14, 2013 3:41 pm

lights for safety only enought to see safe.. workbench has 2x9watt LED downlights.
3.04kW Grid Tie system 16 of 190W PVs, Samil 3.3kW
3.8kW PV Stand Alone Off Grid.. 5-8kWHr Per day
24 of 190W PVs
Midnite Classic 150 & Lite MPPT
8 of 6V 600 AH flooded cells (24 volt 1200 AH)
Outback VFX3024E Inverter Charger
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