EMP resistant?

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EMP resistant?

Postby Dav333 » Mon May 03, 2010 1:45 am

Hi. Can these portable solar panels withstand a EMP attack?
Do these panels have any chips, circuitry inside? or is it just simple wires & panels?

Chances of an attack happening must be super slim especially in Aus, but just good to know. If we cant use electricity in a postEMP world, need to make shore solar panels work.

thanks in advance
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Re: EMP resistant?

Postby Tracker » Mon May 03, 2010 2:59 pm

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Wow - That's a good one.. I would be more concerned for what caused the EMP than if PV panels would survive.

In answer to your question - Most panels have By-Pass diodes fitted, to the discrete series arrays within the panel.. Panels are not normally just a mass of cells.
They might typically be made from three groups of (series) cells in parallel.

Don't forget that you would need to plan for a Stand-Alone system ( Island operation ).
Normal Grid-Connected PV power does NOTHING, if the mains power is out.
To be NEMP proof, you would have to also protect all other electrics in the system.
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Re: EMP resistant?

Postby monocrystal » Mon May 03, 2010 3:43 pm

Think of a PV as a heap of PN diodes (36 or72 diodes in series), with a EMP expousure ill worry about the inverter 1st as a PN junction of a microchip/fet/transistor is much much smaller than a PN wafer of a PV panel.
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Re: EMP resistant?

Postby Dav333 » Mon May 03, 2010 5:20 pm

Sorry I was just talking about the portable ones.
Is it still the same?
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Re: EMP resistant?

Postby Tracker » Mon May 03, 2010 5:45 pm

Dav333 wrote:..Sorry I was just talking about the portable ones... .. Is it still the same?..


Yes, I don't think there will be any difference.. Panels in the garage, could have their diodes blown, as might the panels that were in use.. .. .. COULD is the operative word..
Problem is that some don't like "uncertain" words like could, so we might have to wait until it happens and then talk about it !

All I can say is there is no specification, for EMP protection with most Solar Panels.

There might be Mil-Spec panels, but you can be sure that they are beyond our budgets..

Anyway, I really would not worry, but if anything happens, please do let us know !
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Re: EMP resistant?

Postby Joey » Tue May 04, 2010 4:38 am

Luckily Solar panels are designed to convert energy from the sun into power , I think EMP receivers would be an added extra :lol:
Solar panels are no more designed to resist EMP's than golf balls are to resist micro waves.

Crap now I'll have to give Suntech a call and ask if my panels are Micro wave resistant , our microwave operates just below our panels!

Now seriously give me a break, panels are diode protected which will prevent EMP problems, this is most ridiculous thing I have ever heard of ( apart from life energy ) .
Not that this is even worth an explanation but all inverters have MOV ( Metal Oxide Varistor ) input protection to protect them from transient input voltages that could damage the inverter input stages etc.
I am not even going to bother with the rest of the explanation , I have a tin foil hat to make!
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Re: EMP resistant?

Postby Tracker » Tue May 04, 2010 8:26 am

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Joey wrote:Now seriously give me a break, panels are diode protected which will prevent EMP problems, this is most ridiculous thing I have ever heard of


Well, one can only assume that your Suntech panels must be real crap, if they don't have By-Pass Diodes fitted.
Shucks - and some were saying what good panels they were. :o
My El-Chepo ones sure do.!

The question that was asked, was
Dav333 wrote:Do these panels have any chips, circuitry inside? or is it just simple wires & panels?


An Straight-Forward but ill-reasoned question. and
.. .. Straight-Forward answer - I thought - Yes they do have bits in them !

Sorry - that you presumed that the response was implying that panels were protected by these diodes -
I thought they were Bypass diodes for cell failure and shading reasons.

I admit that I am now more confident that before about the Inverters, when you say that they have MOV's fitted and they they will survive an EMP.
I presumed that they would go poof, .. along with the DVD player.

What would I know? . .. .. I was not around for the last BANG !

I presume that you are saying that they also have MOV's on the Grid Outputs and on the Comms-Port, and the case is fully Faraday-shielded... ..
And I had presumed that DAV333 was planning an Island operation, lest he finds that his surviving Power-Setup, does not work because there is NO GRID POWER !

YES - Perhaps, I should have been more abrupt, and said --
"Your bloody joking - Of course they have 'things' in there - but the fine vacuum deposited tracks would be flashed and gone, likely long before even the By-Pass Diodes would see the pulse.
... .. . And you , the owner, might :o not be feeling very well, anyway :!: ."

"BUT - if you arrange your panels correctly - You might be able to use the panels as a rain shelter, to keep some of the radioactive rain off you, provided that they were not hit by flying golf-balls, blasted from the local GC."
:( Derrrr!

So to DAV333, I need to qualify things after being suitably and technically chastised and corrected, and so that you CLEARLY understand..

NO - Your panels WILL-NOT-SURVIVE an NEMP or an EMP, or MP.. Just like we might not.
( Sorry - for not being certain - I know we are not allowed to THINK here, and must be positive, correct and certain !)
PV panels are giant Semi-Conductors (hundreds of them in fact) , with fine printed connections, all of which would be "troubled" by an EMP. .. .. " One Flash, and it's ash ", as they say !

So DAV333, what you could do is to bury spare panels a few meters down and then after the blast, dig them up and be confident that you will still have power for survival, because we are confidently advised that your inverter has MOV's and WILL survive the EMP..

Thanks - for your clarification, Joey.. I'll start digging at first light ! ;)
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PS - DAV333 - To be technically correct - you had better bury an inverter along with the spare panels - and spare everything else like LED-Torches) because I don't think (Oops - Sorry - :( ) an exposed Inverter will survive.
But be confident that the MOV's in your old inverter, will be available should you ever need spares.!

MOV's and cockroaches - they WILL live on !
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Re: EMP resistant?

Postby MichaelB » Tue May 04, 2010 2:30 pm

Keep things friendly and civil please folks.

Tracker:

"( Sorry - for not being certain - I know we are not allowed to THINK here, and must be positive, correct and certain !)"

That is totally incorrect and I've already gone into some detail with you about recent issues relating to some of your posts. Read over my comments and PM's again if you *still* don't understand what I'm getting at; PM me and tell me what you don't understand.
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Re: EMP resistant?

Postby angkrouse » Thu Aug 11, 2011 6:11 am

I think the poster's original question is interesting and am not impressed by others who want to discount it with the attitude that more important worries would be fallout, etc. Getting hit by an EMP, does not mean a full-scale attack with radiation. It is possible to detonate a very unsophisticated, low-grade nuclear bomb in the atmosphere above a country without creating Chernobyl. The intent would actually be to keep the environment in tact and destroy all electronics . . . communication devices, power grid, etc.

I am very interested in an answer to that question and whether there are any producers of wind turbines and solar panels that have thought of this issue and created a product resistant to it.
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Re: EMP resistant?

Postby franks » Wed Aug 17, 2011 1:26 pm

I would say a PV panels would be EMP resistant, Comms Satellites in outer space are PV powered, and do get large doses of solar radiation with solar flares being common.
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