New to the world of LED Lighting

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Re: New to the world of LED Lighting

Postby Beginner » Fri Feb 07, 2014 1:32 pm

Hello,

I'm new here and doing some research/study on the LED lamp saving.

I'm from Malaysia and working for a glove manufacturing co.

We're planned to change all the fluorescent tube lamp to LED type,

My questions is:

Supposing I saved 1 kW of electrical power through the use of single phase/240V LED lamps, will I also saved 1kW of power at the MV side where the electrical metering is done?

We're using 11KV elect. supply.

Thanks if somebody can help me on this
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Re: New to the world of LED Lighting

Postby Tracker » Sat Feb 08, 2014 10:28 am

Bthree wrote:,........., LED lights have really come of age and I am certainly happy with the current offerings, ......

..
Oh they certainly have... As reported earlirer.. I am moving around the house actively replacing ALL lights.. starting with the most often used..
The process is VERY rewarding with great results ..
I am retrofitting ES bases to the old PLC down lights.. I like the concept of 240v -- ie self contained.. none of those issues with transformers and psu's......

I got onto the Nation Star oyster fittings (smd fringe elements) and with a small Modification, started fitting them to Ceiling Fans..
Again, a very pleasing result. I do prefer 28ooK but go for 30ooK in production areas..

Ita Vero .... LEDs have come of age..

My only issue is something that I did not anticipate ... I now am looking at dimming, and I NEVER thought that would be an issue... what a great "problem" to face..
..
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Re: New to the world of LED Lighting

Postby Graeme.Ambrose » Sat Feb 08, 2014 12:32 pm

To Beginner
If you replace the tubes with LED you will save on energy most certainly. However, you must also disable the ballast in the fitting as well, especially if you are billed(and metered) on kVA. The reason for this is that leaving the ballast intact will mean that you would be consuming 36W (assuming two tubes per fitting, 1200mm) but upwards of 160 VA. Your power factor will go through the floor.
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Re: New to the world of LED Lighting

Postby Tracker » Sat Feb 08, 2014 7:57 pm

Beginner wrote:.......Supposing I saved 1 kW of electrical power through the use of single phase/240V LED lamps, will I also saved 1kW of power at the MV side where the electrical metering is done?.........


And the answer is a yes... ;) 1kW is irrespective of voltage ...

I must say that it is likely good to look closely at the relative cost of replacing tubes and purchasing entire fittings... eg.. to replace a 2' tube was going to be about 25 bucks and a complete new fitting. 50 bucks
The tubes that I buy come with shorting starters (to bridge out the starters... I do admit that I have not yet seen an instruction declaring the need to remove the ballast..... I do wonder if with the lower current, that there would be a big loss via pf ...
But I have removed the ballast on the couple I changed..
..
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Re: New to the world of LED Lighting

Postby Graeme.Ambrose » Sun Feb 09, 2014 10:52 am

there is an excellent article on the subject. It can be downloaded here:
http://expertenergy.com.au/documents/Re ... 0Tubes.pdf
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Re: New to the world of LED Lighting

Postby Tracker » Mon Feb 10, 2014 10:50 am

Graeme.Ambrose wrote:there is an excellent article on the subject. It can be downloaded here:

good find... I must say that I would not have thought that the problem is as great as they say..

As highlighted in Picture 3; an unmodified troffer with LED or T5 retrofit tubes installed can have a power factor (pf) of ~0.25, which means that 25% of the total power drawn through the electrical circuit is used for “real work”. The other ~75% is due to increased inefficiencies, introduced by the retrofit tubes, within the electrical load that restricts the 100% conversion of total power drawn (Apparent Power) into electrical work achieved (Real Power).
Even though the wattage has reduced by 56%, the current (A) has increased by 53% compared to the original 2 x 36W Fluorescent tube troffer.

..
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Re: New to the world of LED Lighting

Postby Patricia » Tue Jul 15, 2014 8:50 pm

I am very very new to LED lighting. One week to be precise. I live in New Zealand but I presume everything is the same across the ditch or is that too much of a presumption!
I want to replace the 3 100W lights in my sitting room with LED lights. I am getting too old to keep on climbing up ladders to replace light bulbs. My house was built in the 1970s and my sitting room, which is L shaped, has a cathedral ceiling with a number of beams across, three of which have 1 100w bulb on each of them. Currently each bulb, which is long and narrow about 12cm long, fits with in a metal box on the beam and shines upwards. Each beam is approximately 44mm wide and 3 metres long. Apart from getting up and down a ladder I have been quite happy with that lighting because the soft light diffuses down and I use a lamp to read by. Unfortunately now each fitting needs to be replaced and that is when the electrician talked of LED lights. So off I went to the shop to see what was available. And that was when the trouble started. What I thought would be good would be the sort of tape LED lighting so that this sticky tape went right along each of the 3 beams. I wouldn't be able to see any fitting. Wonderful - I like my beams. The sales man said yes it would give the lighting equivalent of what I currently have, the shops electrical engineer said yes but my electrician said no. Now my electrician is probably in his 50s and he has been my electrician for a long long time so I listen to him. It is quite expensive, so what I thought I would do, and to keep the peace with my electrician, would be to try the tape on just one beam for the time being. Now the electrician talks of channels, drivers, transformers, dimmers so I need some independent advice PLEASE.
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Re: New to the world of LED Lighting

Postby davidg » Tue Jul 15, 2014 11:00 pm

Patricia wrote:It is quite expensive, so what I thought I would do, and to keep the peace with my electrician, would be to try the tape on just one beam for the time being. Now the electrician talks of channels, drivers, transformers, dimmers so I need some independent advice PLEASE.

I'm over 50 so I guess from the same era well :(

However you should be able to get "kit" that has all the bits needed in the one box even a remote control so all you need is an outlet to be installed so the "plugpack" can plugged in, the remote control gives you the colors you want "yes I know your thinking colours :o " but once set the normal switch be be used to turn it on and off, yes it is a roll of leds and it is stick on, we get them from wholesalers here, not retailers, use them for lots of places work a treat pretty easy to install, just don't have the specific info handy right now.
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Re: New to the world of LED Lighting

Postby Patricia » Wed Jul 16, 2014 9:23 am

Thank you so much David for replying so quickly. I am getting the picture. This site is so helpful. What is the difference between a driver and a transformer? And what are they? How big is this "plug pack"? Is it better to have a "channel"? In other words if the tape did not have a channel and was just stuck on the top of the beam would the dust affect it over time? I want the tape to last the rest of my life. What sort of wattage on the tape do I need to provide the 100W I have now? Does the tape have the same spread as a normal light? The salesman wants to sell me a 14W tape (I think - I haven't got a quote for that so it is just from memory) or a 24V C 28.5W 2800LM 1.5m LED bar light - that is directly from his quote. A big difference. I don't want to do open heart surgery in my sitting room and so that is why I thought of a dimmer. I can't buy an actual roll here - I don't think - we have to buy it by the metre. I, or the electrician who is coming to see me this weekend, have to measure the whole beam and then I tell the salesman what I want.
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Re: New to the world of LED Lighting

Postby Tracker » Wed Jul 16, 2014 10:26 am

Driver and transformer..

LED's need a constant current to work efficiently and achieve their life expectancies ..

a typical strip LED would have resistors in built to limit the current, and so they would likely use a transformer or more correctly, a power pack, to give the constant voltage.. constant, being the imperative..

A driver, is similar to a transformer, but iinstead of producing a constant VOLTage, it produces the constant CURRENT that leds need.. typically, they might work from 80 to 240v..
And that could suggest their being used during daylight, with solar panels directly connected, for those dark rooms..

Most direct replacement bulbs, have their drivers built into the bulb... COOLING is the most important thing for LEDs... long life if going to be determined by how well the heat is dispersed..

The thing with LEDs is the LUMENS they produce.. the POWER or current will always be less that a normal incandescent bulb.. LUMENS is the measure of the light intensity.. ideally you need the linens to be the same..

http://www.anyware.com.au

Have a peak at this site.. at the LED section... it might give some ideas on availability..

Something that comes to mind... I just bought some LED tubes from ALDI.. got them as leftovers at a really cheap price.. they would never sell, as they were 5ft.ers. no one would normally have that size...
Now the thought is that with these tubes, you just connect 240v to two pins on one end.. the leds all face the same way.. you could secure the tube atop the beam pointing up, like the sticky strips.
Ie no fittings. NEUTRAL or WARM white..

Anyway.... have a look... you could likely get the local shop to order items, or get your computer shop to order them for you.. :idea:

PS... I just replaced all the wretched halogen bulbs at my daughter's place with LEDs... what a difference that will make to their power bills..
..
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