Energy Matters Forums

[Col]

Hi I've heard a lot of hype about the compressed air cars from Tata and MDI. Does anyone know the latest?
I'd love to bring them out to Aus sometime to encourage investment in construction here. I think they need nearly $2 bn to build a plant. They came out to Aus last year but times are very different now.

Col

[Radical Larry]

From what I've read compressed air vehicles are useful in densely populated cities as it displaces the pollution from light, short distance commuters. This is a bad fit for Australia - the distances are too great, the average commuter vehicle too heavy, the smog problem not bad, and the energy grid too dirty.

The transportation issue in this country is a hard one as we simply don't have the population density to warrant huge mass transit infrastructure. Replacing the country's fleet with grid sourced (electric, compressed air, hydrogen whatever suits your application) vehicles will at least double the required capacity.

[Col]

Thanks Larry. Compressed air range from 200km for pure compressed air to 1100 km with a air/fuel motor at 2 l/100km of fuel: duel, petrol or biofuel its pretty good and appropriate for even regional Australia.
The car manufacturing and fuel costs seem way under current fuel hybrid and electric jobs.
Nothing wrong with solar or wind to make your electricity for the air compressor.
Anyway we are interested in bringing some of these babies out o Aus to show case to industry. If anyone out there is thinking along similar lines for their sustainability expos keep me in the loop.

Shine on

Col

[Radical Larry]

Compressed air range from 200km for pure compressed air to 1100 km with a air/fuel motor at 2 l/100km of fuel: duel, petrol or biofuel its pretty good and appropriate for even regional Australia.

These numbers really shocked me, I should have done more research. Found a site describing the MDI engine:

http://www.thefuture.net.nz/mdi_tech.htm

Great leap forward in this field, very impressed. To continue playing devil's advocate, however, the AirPod's top speed of 45-70km/h (source: http://www.thefuture.net.nz/mdi_tech.htm) and it's (assumed due to light weight) low safety rating is really going to limit it to inner city commuting, even with the 220km range.

The larger OneFlowAir seems more practical but with a price tag of €9200, having to choose between the motorway friendly model (motorway range: 1500km, urban range: 50km) and the urban friendly model (motorway range: -, urban range 180km) is going to be a tough hurdle.

As I said, definitely a huge step forward, but still a long way to go, even with a doubling or tripling of fuel costs.

[maxwell]

I have heard of MDI using compressed air for portable gensets recharged from solar ,
this would reduce the use of standby batteries expesially in country areas prone to
regular black outs such as WA. and is proposed to be extremerly cheap , Hope it Happens

[Sceptic]

Sorry to rain on the parade but the energy cost of compressing air is huge compared to the deliverable energy and there is no way long range compressed air powered cars will work successfully.
About 85% of the energy required to compress a given amount of air is lost as heat rejected from the compression process and the effeciency of any air motor is limited.
Even if you had a 50% effecient motor you would have an energy return of 7.5% on the input energy not to mention the considerable mass of pressure vessels required to contain the compressed air once you have a suitable compression system in place.
The use of compressed air in this aplication is not sensible better to use higher effeciency cycles.

Sceptic

[Col]

Hi
I'm glad there is so much interest in the Compressed Air Car possibilities. Its great.
What I'm looking for is a an organisation or people with a similar interest to showcase the technology in Aus to see it for ourselves and evaluate it in an informed way to consider investment in its construction right here
.
So if anyone has an interest or knows someone with an interest in these things drop us a line.

regards

Col

[mobile_mad_max]

This sounds like a great idea.If we could get the air motor to have some sort of effiency, like even 50% this could become a very viable option. One of the best ideas of heard of in a long time.Please keep me in the loop as i would like to know more.

[john m]

Hi, I'm also interested in the compressed air vehicles. I believe they would be a more environmentally friendly option if the compressing was done with the help of wind turbines or pv panels in the home of the owner or at the supplier of "air".
All the best - john m

[Sam]

If you are interested in Compressed Air and its applications you may be interested in this link http://www.indranet.co.nz/sustainability/ttftt.html about sustainability and how this company intends to use compressed air in both stationery and mobile applications.

Take a look at http://www.thefuture-energy.com this site is following the developments. There are plans to test compressed air systems in Melbourne and other parts of Victoria as well as in Christchurch, NZ

Sam